For this weeks feature, Applause Music sat down with musical and screen writer Mick McCullagh aka Son Of The Hound. A known and respected face in the Northern Irish music scene, McCullagh was the brains behind the popular web-series 'The Also Rans' and is the frontman and principle songwriter of his own band. We sat down to discuss his writing, music career and the ins and outs of his creative process.
What actually drew you to music?
I got caught drinking for the first time when I was 13, and the next day my uncle was found dead. So I never got in trouble for it. A couple of relatives flew over for the funeral, and my 16 year old cousin Ryan came over. He was made into Oasis. I had a wee plastic Argos guitar that was never played, but he knew how to play it and he showed me how to do Wonderwall. Once I learnt that, that was it. I showed my parents and they were all loving it, so I managed to avoid getting into trouble by learning guitar so I thought “well, I better keep this up.” They were always really encouraging after that. Within a coupe of years I was in my first band. My first gig was at an all-catholic girls school. (laughs) What a baptism by fire! We came third place, there were four of us in the band and we won three easter eggs. We played Stand By Me, the Oasis version, and it was probably shocking.
So Oasis was the first love then? Can you remember the minute you fell in love with music?
I had a terrible taste in music when I was younger. Papa Roach, Linkin Park (editors note: Linkin Park are not indicative of anything other than a fantastic taste in music), Guns and Roses. Springsteen was always a constant though. My first Springsteen concert I remember so vividly. Me and my mate Ciaran went down to the RDS in 2009. It was a life affirming moment, I couldn’t believe that there was a person who made pop like The Beatles but wrote like Dylan, both of whom I was into at the time. When I was coming out of the gaff today and it was raining, I went to grab a jacket and I had three denim jackets. Thats too many, thats a proper springsteen fans cupboard.
What was the inspiration behind your debut album, 'Cheers Sound Good Luck'
Well Springsteen and how he writes… I don’t know, I hate the act of self-mythologising. I wasn’t like "I've to go in and document this feeling in they air", I just wanted to go in and record these songs, and if theres a theme running through them, running through my mind… I mean I'm not trying to be the voice of a generation. I don’t know enough about politics to get angry, that why everything sounds so sad all the time, like im just moping about the place.
Well if there was no overarching theme, why these songs in particular?
They were just the best 10 songs I thought. Thats kind of the blessing with the first album, they're all slightly stylistically different. Someone told me there was a track that could go on Grease, which is a massive compliment, but then The Also-Rans is completely different from the rest of the songs. But I was also thinking, I might never get to do this again so I just need to put my best 10 songs in. i think lyrically they are cohesive enough
It had the feeling that it was years in the making. Is this fair?
Well I never got to make an album before. I made a mini one years ago of kind of folky tunes in 2012, but I wanted to do a full album, so I guess it was coming. At this point, after years in this game, I’m in too deep. Being an artist should be a viable career if you are good enough - maybe I’m not, or maybe no one has decided I am but I wanted to get something out and done.
It seems to be a very lyrically driven album. Is this something you focussed on or did it come naturally?
I feel like very few people really picked up on the lyrics, I think thats my fault for not pushing that side of the brand enough towards people. Philly (BBC Radio 1 DJ Phil Taggart) called it empathy rock, maybe I should have lent into that more, but that goes back to my reluctance to self mythologise. Like if you look at The Also Rans series, I'm much happier taking the piss out of myself than talking normally.
You've spoke at length about the differences and difficulties between songwriting and screenwriting. Can you explain them?
All stories follow the same journey, they're all circular. You start at the top of the circle, you've lost everything by the middle etc so you always have that form to fall back on. If you don't, then your story doesn’t work. Even if it's a non linear narrative like Pulp Fiction it would still be set up in a certain way. This is not a new thing, mythologies from every culture that have not interacted have all got this circular form - its called a heroes journey - you always have that to fall back on. So when something isn’t working you can look to that and kind of retrace your steps. Whereas songwriting is like lighting in a bottle sometimes. I know people who can sit down and whittle away at a song for hours or days, but thats never been my style. Im much more inspiration driven and it can come out quite quickly, but what if im not inspired? That can wreak havoc with your sense of self worth. Like there are paths you can go down, you CAN force it but you’ll never be happy with it. People are great at rewriting and re-drafting but i not disciplined enough to sit down like that.
You seem to have a knack for storytelling in all your writing. Do you agree with this, and if so where do you think it comes from?
If you said to me go and write a story Id be able to do it but on the spot… My da is a great, naturally funny storyteller. Whereas I am anticipating the high and lows of a story and if people don’t react the same way I imagine, then the panic sets in. In real time I'm bad but if I have the time I can get my head around it. Once I get an idea I usually know, I get the crux of the story and it gets easier. Then the idea just flows out.
Do you think honesty is an important factor in art?
I have been in meetings where people have said we need to work on the brand, not the band. That scene in The Also Rans is based in reality. Dishonesty in PR and stuff doesn’t annoy me, I get annoyed at myself for not just sucking it up and doing it. I don't know what it is that makes it impossible for me to do. I think its insecurities, its like getting into a career and getting annoyed at having to do something part and partial to the job. Like its as if i became a footballer and didn't want to train three times a week. Being a musician is so much more than just writing songs and it has been so much more than that for so long. So I think my inability or unwillingness to do so is born from an insecurity so I’ve just said "fuck it, I'm just gonna be as honest as possible." Is that then a brand in itself? (laughs) But I don’t know if it's self sabotage or insecurities. I see people with great brands, like Beauty Sleep. And they’re just themselves! But they have a consistent sound, image and brand and its not disingenuous. Maybe I don’t know who I am (laughs) I don’t know who I am, or who my audience is thats the problem.
So it's mostly an internal problem rather than an external one?
What bothers me about it is my own insecurities. I’m too insecure to commit to a brand and I’ve been in the game long enough to spot a bluff when I see it - thats what makes me sad, the bluff. Because I cant bring myself to do it. It's a mix of insecurities and pride. And thats absolutely been to my detriment. If you refuse to play the game, you can hardly get annoyed when you lose.
Why do you not play more Son Of The Hound shows?
I don’t think people will come (we point out that he sold out two venues in a row) But like, I feel like I built up a lot of goodwill over the years, and that helped, but I can’t match the build up of a series wrap or an album launch. I can’t ask people or pay people enough to dedicate their time to out on the gig with me, I can’t ask people to come spend money (laughs) name a hang up and I’ve got it. I mean I would love to be out gigging, once I’m playing it all goes away. I don’t know, I don’t wanna be doing… im 32 and the guys are all the same age. They all have lives and children and jobs and dogs and partners (Editors note: partners noticeably last, after dogs), and I just feel guilty about asking them to give up their time. Because there is no money in it. I try to pay them as much as I can, I'm forever saying thank you for giving me your time, everyone is sound but I can’t shake the feeling that I’m being indulged. I love entertaining people. I love it more than anything. I usually have an idea of what craic I’m gonna have, until I get on stage that is, but its a long road till there and its hard to shake the feeling that im not worth peoples time. Maybe its an imposter syndrome.
How do you feel like you’ve changed from the album?
Its been my best year! Even thought I’ve spent the last 40 mins talking about how shit everything is. Poor Orlagh has to listen to this all the time. But it has been, the last year, I've just went for it. I think I'll prob do another album but its gonna be completely different. It’ll be a lot more cohesive. I'm gonna do it until its no longer feasible. I mean I've always been in the red but I'm not a kid anymore. You go from being an young upstart to a scene staple to road worn troubadour to scene veteran. Maybe I just have to shift my parameters of success. I am my own worse enemy. But when I released that mini album years ago, and when I released this album it felt like the right thing to do. People have levelled at me that I’m pulled in too may directions, but at the end of the day at least I was honest to myself.
What are you trying to say with your music
We’re all playing the smoke and mirrors game. We're all scared. We're all sad. If we're all scared and sad together, we might get through to the end. As Joe Strummer said, without people you’re nothing. Because with the script writing stuff, its comedy, but with the music - Its empathy at the end of the day. its good to remind yourself, especially here, that it exists. Because were all fucked. The things I’ve said and thought about myself… it can send me into a spiral, but then you see other people who feel that way too and you think everyone feels that, maybe if we can address that, we can get somewhere?
Why do you keep coming back to music?
I'm committed to it at this point. It's like I say in The Also Rans, it's the only thing I ever knew how to do. It's funny because for about 6 months before the album, I was messaging people who study law and thinking to myself “maybe I'll go back to school and become a lawyer”. Looking back on it, I'd be like Charlie Kelly studying Bird Law. I did try to stop when I was 24, thought to myself "time to get out and put childish things to bed", stopped everything off and moved away. Within a couple of weeks I was back at open mic nights. Its not the money, I know it isn’t. I'm a romantic at heart, even if something took off, I'd aways be back at the music somehow. Like if you look at Elbow, he (Guy Garvey) was on the dole for most of his life. So maybe you have to eat shit for years in every career and the percentage of people who hit the ground running is minuscule. Like you don’t remember the also rans. So maybe its a case of redefining what my version of success is. Is it making a living? Is it scraping by a living? Is it doing what you love? Could you die broke and happy? you can defiantly die broke (laughs) but you could also die happy.